Tools of the Podcast Trade w/J. Rosemarie Francis
Podcasting can seem confusing at times and it doesn't have to be. But new podcasters get caught up with the tech and strategies which sometimes hold them back from owning their genius.
Tools of the Podcast Trade is your ultimate guide to mastering podcasting. Host J. Rosemarie and expert guests share practical tools, strategies, and actionable insights to help aspiring podcasters launch their shows and avoid podfade.
Whether you're a solopreneur, a nonprofit, or someone with a burning message to share, we simplify podcasting and help turn your ideas into a purposeful, successful podcast!
Tools of the Podcast Trade w/J. Rosemarie Francis
Creating Icons Through Podcasting Strategies w/Sheryl Plouffe
Takeaways
- Becoming an icon involves increasing influence, impact, and income.
- Many podcasters quit due to a lack of strategy and return on investment.
- A clear strategy is essential before starting a podcast.
- AI can enhance efficiency but should not replace the human touch.
- Monetization should focus on relationships, not just advertising.
- Building high-trust relationships is key to successful podcasting.
- Podcasting is ideal for fostering meaningful conversations.
- Entrepreneurs often chase tactics instead of developing long-term strategies.
- Self-awareness is crucial for identifying what isn't working in podcasting.
Connect with Sheryl: LinkedIn | Website
Bio: Sheryl Plouffe is a former national TV broadcaster with 25 years of experience who transitioned into entrepreneurship, specializing in video marketing and digital strategies. As the CEO of Icon Maker, she helps entrepreneurs build seven-figure businesses by leveraging podcasting to create high-trust relationships and strategic offers. Sheryl is passionate about empowering business owners to increase their influence, impact, and income through a thoughtful, strategy-first approach.
Connect with us:
Website: https://bit.ly/4h9Of5K
Free Start Your Podcast Now - free step-by-step guide: https://bit.ly/3DlHm26
Book a Free Consultation: https://calendly.com/jrosemarief/30
Instagram: https://tinyurl.com/yc2vxcb6
=====================================
👉Helpful Resources:
Start Your Podcast Quick Start Guide for 9-5ers: https://bit.ly/3DlHm26
Join my Substack: https://bit.ly/3DJAbko
Learn The Secrets To Selling Online: https://bit.ly/3OTExrr
Record, stream, & edit with Riverside: https://shorturl.at/AZ3Lr
Host multiple podcasts on Captivate: https://fas.st/t/4vxsZ9za
Shop Podcast Microphones: https://amzn.to/3Rvz4c7
Get paid to interview guests: https://shorturl.at/htIY4
Podcast hosted by Buzzsprout
Disclosure: This podcast is NOT sponsored. Some links are affiliate links. If you buy a product using one of the links, I may earn a small commission at no extra cost.
J. Rosemarie Francis (00:00.078)
Cheryl Plouffe is the co-founder of Icon Maker. She and her partners lead coaches, consultants, and entrepreneurs to scale to six and seven figures with high-margin programs and podcasting. Listen as she shares her strategies for transforming entrepreneurs into icons through podcasting. I'm J. Rose Marie. Thank you for listening.
be sure to subscribe to our YouTube channel, Tools of the Podcast Trade, where you'll watch actual interviews with industry thought leaders and icon makers like Sheryl.
J. Rosemarie Francis (00:01.23)
My guest today is Sheryl Plough. Thanks for coming and speaking to us today on Tools of the Podcast, Trade Sheryl. I appreciate
Sheryl Plouffe (00:09.464)
Great to be here, Jen, looking forward to this conversation.
J. Rosemarie Francis (00:12.822)
Yes, we know you are the CEO, I believe, of Icon Maker, but before we get into that, could you tell us who is Sheryl?
Sheryl Plouffe (00:22.972)
Well, I am a wife, a mother, a business advisor, a partner. I mean, I'm so many things, but my background really is in television broadcasting. That's what I did professionally for 25 years here in Canada. 17 of those I spent on national television. So I started in TV when I was 18 years old, my, clawed my way, I say worked my way, but clawed my way up to the national stage by the time I was 30.
J. Rosemarie Francis (00:46.872)
Mm -hmm.
Sheryl Plouffe (00:50.364)
and then left that profession in 2017 to start my own business. And I still run that business today with some private client work around video marketing and digital marketing, that sort of thing. But Icon Maker really is a project and a joint venture that came about in 2023 between me and two of my business partners. And we decided that we would join forces together to start this new enterprise.
around helping entrepreneurs build their seven bigger businesses with
J. Rosemarie Francis (01:21.512)
Okay, all right. Thank you. We're in Canada, are
Sheryl Plouffe (01:24.942)
I'm in the southwestern part of Ontario, so I'm in the most southernmost point of Canada. I'm actually right now at the lake house, the cottage right now, but where I live as my permanent residence is down in southwestern Ontario.
J. Rosemarie Francis (01:39.502)
Okay, I asked because I'm Canadian. I lived in Toronto and British Columbia, so yeah.
Sheryl Plouffe (01:44.26)
Me too, me too. I'm an island girl. lived in Nanaimo, BC for my teenage years. Yes, you? Good.
J. Rosemarie Francis (01:49.588)
Okay, all right, pretty cool. All right, you, icon maker, the sound like you create icons in the entrepreneurial space. So how do you do that? Like what benefit can someone gain from you, Sheryl, to help them be better entrepreneurs?
Sheryl Plouffe (02:16.668)
Well, I mean, I think if we break down, what does that mean to become an icon in your niche? In our view, it's really about having more influence in your work, right? And also having more impact through what you do and also obviously more income. It's really those three areas that we help people to focus on. How we do that is through leveraging podcasting to build high trust relationships between guests and hosts. And then we also help people to get
J. Rosemarie Francis (02:43.576)
Mm -hmm.
Sheryl Plouffe (02:45.99)
clear on who they're serving. It's surprising to me still how many people need more work in that area of actually defining who is the right client and also their offers, Jen. know, we at IconMaker, we help, it's a very comprehensive program from A to Z to help them build a seven figure business. Obviously we need to have an offer that's going to help attain that goal. And so we help them figure that out. Who is, who is it want to serve in what capacity.
And how do we take that and put it into a high ticket program framework so that you can accomplish your goals? So I think in essence, being an icon to us is about influence, impact, and
J. Rosemarie Francis (03:26.604)
Okay. All right. Thank you. And I wanted to ask because being an entrepreneur, as well as being a podcaster can feel like, you know, you're an hamster, you're a hamster in the wheel and you see their other, they're the top tiers who are making it big. And they're those who are just struggling to even make an impact. So what are the, what would you tell a podcaster right now?
or an entrepreneur who wants to start a podcast. The first thing to think about before they quit because that's one of the biggest
Sheryl Plouffe (04:08.572)
Yeah, well, statistically, most podcasters don't make it past, I think it's 21 shows because they, like you said, end up on this hamster wheel, whether isn't any return on that investment of time, energy, money, or whatever the case may be. If you're, especially if you're producing it yourself, which we don't think is really necessarily the path. If you want to scale to seven figures, you're going to need to find ways to build in an efficiency around that process.
But I think that where I would start with is to say, really take a step back and ask yourself, what is the strategy for me doing this podcast that's going to lead to business opportunities? And taking that step back and asking yourself that question sometimes reveals that there isn't a strategy and that's the problem. So I'll give you an example, Jen. In our program, we have a five staged approach to helping
clients achieve their goal. The podcasting doesn't even come into play until stage three, right? People are sometimes surprised to hear that. go, well, isn't this the seven figure podcaster program? Let's say, yeah, yes. So what are we doing the podcasting? Valid question. We have a perspective and a wisdom around the order in which to do things in order to get the goal accomplished.
J. Rosemarie Francis (05:25.709)
Right.
Sheryl Plouffe (05:37.392)
And it's not starting with the podcast. It's starting with the stage one in our view is it's about figuring out who you want to serve. It's building an offer. It's validating that offer. It's selling that offer. Stage two is building a conversion mechanism to do that on repeat. Then we get to the podcasting later. And I think that's one of the things that I would advise, right? It's like understanding what is the strategy here and how am I utilizing this amazing
modality, this amazing format in order to truly generate business opportunities.
J. Rosemarie Francis (06:15.382)
Okay. All right. So I can see that if you're starting with a, with a new client, a new entrepreneurial client who don't have a podcast, but what if, know, you got excited and just jumped right in and you know, Hey, it's podcasting. love it. But there's this moment in time you've, you've reached a moment in time where it doesn't seem worth it. What's your advice for that person?
Sheryl Plouffe (06:43.196)
I don't think it's a lost cause. think it's, first of all, I would just commend that person for recognizing that it isn't working out the way that they had intended for it to work. And I don't think that's uncommon. I think a lot of people come into podcasting and they launch the podcast and they're doing the thing and there isn't any, say, return on an investment from a business perspective. And it's not as fruitful as they had thought. They either give up the podcast entirely.
Or what is your other choice? Your other choice is to have self -awareness and recognize, okay, so something isn't working. Who do I need to talk to? Or where do I go to find a solution to making this strategy stronger or better? So it's not a lost cause, but it means that something has to change in order for it to get a different
J. Rosemarie Francis (Jenn) (07:35.342)
So yeah, you need to go back to the drawing board maybe, right? Yeah, okay.
Sheryl Plouffe (07:40.23)
Possibly, possibly, or it depends on what the frustration is. Sometimes the frustration is that a podcaster is producing the shows themselves and spending a lot of time, let's say energy and time of their own to produce these shows without a strategy for it to lead to any kind of business opportunities. So then they just get more and more frustrated and they're up at three o 'clock in the morning editing Zoom videos.
right? And going, why am I doing, why am I doing this again? We operationally and in production of podcasts, like producing podcasts is a, it's work. It's definitely work. And so you have to kind of examine that. And without me knowing the details of this fictional person that we're talking about, it's more about like looking at the, auditing what is the production process right now? Maybe it in and of itself needs to be more efficient.
J. Rosemarie Francis (08:11.244)
Yes.
Sheryl Plouffe (08:36.72)
with tools and technology or AI or other means if that person insists on continuing to produce it themselves.
J. Rosemarie Francis (08:44.046)
All right. Okay. All right. So thank you. I want to talk about AI because there is some confusion around it. I realized because we know it's a tool we can use in podcasting, right? And there are all these platforms who are utilizing it to help us. But how do we differentiate ourselves when we are using these platforms to save time and, you know, keep
keeping on the cutting edge.
Sheryl Plouffe (09:17.518)
My view is that certainly how we're using AI in our own company is that we don't rely on it to do all the work. We rely on it to do some of the heavy lifting in certain cases. We use it more operationally for us in terms of the deliverables for our clients. It helps me to be more efficient with time. It helps to collapse time from what would have taken nine months takes now nine days, or what took nine days now takes nine minutes. And
hugely valuable. So that's kind of how we operate with regard to AI currently. But as it pertains to podcasting, you know, I think that you just look at it as a tool. It is a tool that can help to speed up, you know, your process or to collapse time and to save yourself a lot of time. It's not meant to really replace the human being, right? I think that you don't want, you don't want it to.
You don't want it to, you still need to add your flavor to it. You still need to have that human component to the process. So I think it's more about efficiency and time, collapsing time and buying back some of your
J. Rosemarie Francis (10:27.086)
Thank you. I appreciate you answering these questions. I know they're simple, because a lot of podcasters are new that listen to our show, then, you know, that's why I these basic questions. Yeah, sure. All right. So I want to get into monetization because that's one of the biggest struggles. And even though it seems simple enough, it isn't, is
Sheryl Plouffe (10:39.895)
I love it. This is great.
Sheryl Plouffe (10:54.052)
It can be, but I think people make it more complicated than it needs to be. Most people start a podcast and want to monetize it through advertising or like through, through attracting advertisers or
or selling their own products and services. But most of the time it's, I'm going to start a podcast, I'm going to build my audience, and then I'm going to attract an advertiser who will pay me to run an ad on my show or sponsor on my show. And while that is a viable path, like that is a path to monetize. Here's where the problem is. The problem is that what that advertiser is willing to pay you
you even get to the point where you have enough of an audience that they're even interested to have that conversation, which is a whole entity of itself. It's, let's say $25 per CPM, right? Like per 1000 downloads of your show, which you have to prove that you get, the advertiser might be willing to pay you $25 per mention. Well,
I don't know many entrepreneurs right now who are looking to make $250 in their business right now. Listen, we live in a world where even six figures is not enough anymore. So if you have entrepreneurs looking to reach those milestones of six figures and seven figures and beyond, $25, it's just not going to cut it.
J. Rosemarie Francis (12:27.192)
Bye.
Sheryl Plouffe (12:32.956)
Heady cash could be like cash in your pocket, but it's not really going to do much to move your business forward. So I think that's where the monetization piece falls off. go, well, it takes to build up that enough of an audience. It's going to take several years probably for most people to build it up. And even if you do get there, the advertisers come along saying, yeah, sure. I'll pay you $25 to have a mention on your show. It's a far, far cry from six figures and seven figures. So what is the answer?
The answer and the solution is that it's not about advertisers. It's not about sponsorships. It's not really even about building the audience. It should be about the relationship between the guests and the host. It should be, so for example, you and I are having this conversation. My hope is that Jen, you and I begin to have a relationship here. And I get to know you, you get to know me and who knows where it goes. I don't know. I mean,
Will we stay connected on social? Will I help make another introduction? Maybe I know some people who should be on your show. Happy to make those introductions. We forge a relationship. That is more valuable to me because I don't know who you know or who you have access to. You're bringing great people onto your show. You might think of someone who should be connected to us in the future and make that introduction. It's all interconnected. We don't know what the future holds. So I think it's really about
forging those high trust relationships is the foundation of good business practice. And that will not change no matter what algorithm change happens or what social media platform of the future comes along.
J. Rosemarie Francis (14:11.564)
Yeah, that's an interesting point because we tend to focus on building this connection with our audience, which is very important, but we tend not to, know, get the guest -host relationship tend to just slide away, especially after the promotion ends, right? And yeah, you make an interesting point.
Sheryl Plouffe (14:33.926)
Yep.
J. Rosemarie Francis (14:38.094)
And I think that going back to the $25, trying to qualify for $25 per CPM is distracting because you're trying to dig in the numbers and trying to keep up with the numbers. you could, yeah. So I thank you for that and also bringing up the point about keeping these relationships because I think that's one of the best
of podcasting for me is that I meet so many people and people I'd never meet otherwise. Yeah.
Sheryl Plouffe (15:15.072)
Exactly. And that's the, and you would just hit it. You just hit the nail on the head. That's exactly what it is. You know, without your show, I don't know if we would have connected. I'm not sure if we would have. And so we see a lot of people and I'm sure you can attest to this, but we get, how many spam messages do we get? How many cold DMS do we get? It's like, Hey, I want to, you know, are you looking for more clients this week? I can help you. know, those messages get
J. Rosemarie Francis (15:26.609)
huh. Yes.
J. Rosemarie Francis (15:37.902)
Mm -hmm.
Sheryl Plouffe (15:45.176)
ignored for the most part because they're coming out of nowhere. Whereas you and I now we're forging a relationship, you better believe that the next time you send me a DM or I send you a DM, we're likely to pay attention to each other because we've now established a connection. We've started having a relationship. So that's, that's essentially what it is. But I think that if we change our, and this is what we talked about at our workshop, right? We talked about
J. Rosemarie Francis (15:49.484)
Yes.
Sheryl Plouffe (16:13.542)
changing your mindset around how you'll monetize your podcast with a different strategy. The reason that we focus on podcasting so much is because it's the most natural format and modality to foster conversation and build relationships because it is conversation. That's what we're doing. We're just happy to be doing it within the framework of a podcast. So it's a natural fit for our philosophy that it's about relationship building.
J. Rosemarie Francis (16:30.466)
Yes.
J. Rosemarie Francis (16:41.42)
Yes, that's awesome. All right. What is Sheryl grateful for today?
Sheryl Plouffe (16:48.188)
I'm actually sitting at the cottage today. This is our second home that we have had now. This is our 20th summer in this location at our cottage. And so I'm very grateful for that. I'm in the middle of nature. I'm looking out at the trees. I can hear boats off in the distance on the lake. I'm just grateful for having had the opportunity to spend 20 summers here. And so I'm very grateful for
J. Rosemarie Francis (17:14.126)
Yeah, yeah, awesome, thank you. All right, so tell us how we can get in touch with you and if you have anything, any special or offers going on right now that we could, yeah.
Sheryl Plouffe (17:26.818)
Yeah, well, I mean, a few things. I'm on LinkedIn. I'm on Facebook. You can always send me a message and say that you're on the show and connect with me there and I can send resources your way. We have a Facebook group called Podcast Monetization System. People can join that group. It's a private group, but you can request to join and answer some questions. And then in there, we do often weekly mini trainings and we will teach people different chunks of our strategies in order to help people along in their journey.
whether as a guest or as a host. And then on a monthly basis, we host these workshops. They're lengthy, they're about four hours long. And any of the proceeds to those workshops go to charity as well. So you can find out about that at iconmakerlive .com. Iconmakerlive
J. Rosemarie Francis (18:16.146)
All right, okay, thank you. All right, so I appreciate you coming and talking to us Sheryl and I really enjoy this conversation and I'm a lot as usual. Any parting shots?
Sheryl Plouffe (18:31.994)
I think it's really about having a strategy rather than chasing tactics. know, tactics, tactics only goes so far. Having a strategy is more of a long -term play that will stand the test of your entrepreneurial journey, right? It's understanding what is my strategy here that's underlying this.
So rather than chasing every shiny object, which a lot of entrepreneurs get stuck in that trap of, instead of chasing the shiny objects, you're better off to sit down and say, okay, I need to revisit my strategy to grow.
J. Rosemarie Francis (19:12.694)
All right, thank you. I appreciate you, Sheryl.
Sheryl Plouffe (19:15.344)
Thank you so much, Jen. This has been fun. Thank you for having me on your show.